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and this is weapons

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the idea that the CIA created the UFO

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mystery as a way to distract the tension

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away from spy planes is is ridiculous I

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mean Area 51 did not become a UFO hot

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spot because people outside the base

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were seeing spy planes landing there it

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became a UFO hotspot because of things

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that people from inside the base were

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saying what do you mean people who had

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shared with me bits and pieces of

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information who said they'd been out

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there

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and it's seen something that looked like

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a flying saucer and a hangar or had seen

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them land in the desert Security Guys

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scientists electronic technicians and

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other people who'd been at the base in

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the 50s 60s 70s and 80s who shared

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little bits of pieces of information

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with me to bolster the account that had

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been told by Bob Lazar I get it so so

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people try to claim that uh you know a

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lot of these sightings are from the

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outside and they're misidentifying

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things what you're saying and I know

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this to be true now that I understand

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what you're saying it's really people

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from the inside that came to you and

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come to us now so wow yeah that kind of

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let that sink in a second I I really

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appreciate that Al O'Donnell uh shared

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this information with me I'm glad that

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he shared a version of the story with

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Annie even though that they're very much

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in Conflict the more light that just

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shed on Area 51 uh you know it long up

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to a certain point that we don't

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endanger National Security the better

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and I wish that I could get a definitive

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answer one of these days about which

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version if either of them is true

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well

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um

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[\h__\h]

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well I don't know man I I guess the um

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I guess the question that I have now

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coming

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are you ever going to get the deathbed

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confession tape that this guy made for

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you from his son doubtful why

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I've had no contact with him for a long

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time

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um I think that they it depends on which

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version it is they may not the one that

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he recorded may not be the official

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story that they want out anymore they

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might prefer the one that they told

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Annie Jacobson

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um I don't have any contact with the

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family anymore maybe I should try to

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reach out to him but uh yeah before this

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episode goes live I think you should

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seems doubtful that um that it's gonna

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it's gonna happen but you know I was

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really happy to be able to

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um interact with how all those all those

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years ago and uh really wish that I was

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in a position to give more definitive

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proof about it but I was just wanted to

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explain to people the process of how it

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worked and how you tried to develop

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sources in this wacky field yeah you

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always say the trick to being seen as

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trustworthy is to actually consistently

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be trustworthy and you know you've kind

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of told me a few things in journalism

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that are like you know the solid points

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and the first thing you ever told me is

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protect your sources even if they don't

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protect themselves

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and then the second thing was the

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trustworthiness you know and I think

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that you have to consistently show that

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because for you and me and our

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experiences even today which we're you

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know we can't talk about but even today

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the idea that somebody would call us

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right and and

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we have to prove again that we're

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trustworthy and and you've got to do

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that you got to do that you know don't

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tell anybody about this you promised me

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and and I love that I'm like okay I did

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promise you I'm confirming to you again

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because people get kind of panicked yeah

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so your process as a journalist when you

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have had these sources that were

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threatened and you had these sources

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that confide in you and have the sources

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create death bad confessions but you

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can't [\h__\h] release it you know we get

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a lot of flack for that I mean I don't

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read online anymore I'm sorry guys that

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Dawn is too crazy right but like people

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send me screenshots what people are

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saying they get so mad

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like we're sitting on stuff so for

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example when we released when we

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released that mosul orb image

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uh we had been sitting on this for a

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long time but we had to go because we

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don't know who gave it to us directly

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but then we started getting it from

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multiple people we always make sure that

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we don't know where an image comes from

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directly and so you know sometimes we do

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now directly but we're protected by

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Shield law as journalists in America

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right so which means that we can protect

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our sources so anybody that gives us

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stuff we can protect them because we are

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protected but people get mad that we sit

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back on on information if you've got

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such great information put it out here's

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the deal people have families people

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will

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they're taking a huge risk sometimes not

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always but sometimes now we have to

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consistently we have to consistently

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show that we are worthy of that trust as

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reporters and journalists so we have to

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also vet stuff because we don't like

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everybody else you can just like throw

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something up on Twitter to get a bunch

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of hits hold on these are people's lives

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and when we want to know ourselves we

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want to know if this is the right

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information and every single thing you

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and I have put out has been verified

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authenticated and if people think it's

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not and there's there's talk otherwise

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hold on to your seats yeah isn't that

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moselor wasn't that a raindrop or

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something on the on the lens I heard it

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was a pothole yeah I mean everything

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except for a round seagulls everything

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but the kitchen sink or a UFO yeah look

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um

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I wish

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that with the information

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that we have right that we could just

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you know give everybody the smack like

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that it's not our job I am hoping that

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our government is honest with the

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American people that Arrow

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that the new UFO office is honest with

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the American people and has a a

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promotion of an idea of transparency UFO

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transparency it is not our job to do

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everything it is our job to address the

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issues make them public and see where

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the chips fall I believe in other people

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there are great people working on this

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right now I have never been resisted

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always assisted different than you I've

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never been resisted so I I really hope

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I'm very hopeful and optimistic as as a

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person I am about the UFO topic UFO

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truth and I do think this could be the

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biggest story of all time if we find out

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some of the truth well the jury is still

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out on Arrow I'd like to believe that

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they're going to live up to the promises

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that they've made that there are going

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to strive toward transparency I haven't

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seen it yet I haven't seen a whole lot

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of indication that's true I do give them

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the benefit of the doubt in that they

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they're tackling this it's taken me like

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35 years to get my head around it and

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it's a steep learning curve for them to

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figure it all out so I'm willing to cut

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them a little bit of slack for a while

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what I've seen so far has not been

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encouraging but I'm hope hoping that

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they'll live up to the lofty promises

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that they've made well I I do know that

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people reach out to us all the time to

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wrap their head around the bigger issues

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right to see to so they don't spin their

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wheels that you know I know that that

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does happen I am actually encouraged but

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by arrow and and the reason I am

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encouraged by arrow that it's not going

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to be a Project Blue Book whitewash kind

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of thing it's because of the The

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Whistleblower legislation and if you

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just looked at the arrow PowerPoint that

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I think it's like seven pages that tell

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their mandate the Departments that are

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involved it nationally and

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internationally it is set up to be

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serious it always ends up being who's

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the head if the head says okay let's be

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transparent like our friend

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um Jay Stratton you know he directly

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told us that what he wanted to do was

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not have another Project Blue Book what

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he wanted to do as a person as an

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individual was to have an open dialogue

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with the American public about what's

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going on with UFOs and I think he did a

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spectacular job when he was in that

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position of power to try to do that and

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now talking publicly everywhere else and

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kind of putting himself out there I

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admire him I admire that he does that I

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fingers crossed and I am I am encouraged

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by that document right by that

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PowerPoint that they're on the right

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track and if arrow is listening at the

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people that work in there are listening

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hey ma'am

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the American public wants that they want

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honesty they want truth it is your duty

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you work for the American people please

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do it right because if not you're going